1. "This is the idea behind a self-spreading viral "coronavirus vaccine," and may be what SARS-CoV-2 was actually designed to be
Self-spreading but non-replicating?
How would it spread? If it spread, that would mean it would be replication competent no? and that would then involve an actual infection and T-cells and all.
What I had in mind is understanding would just having high levels of ambient but not acute exposure mean for a human upper respiratory tract and mouth as well. Would it be like being exposed to multiple viral proteins but not a whole virus being expelled from someone's body? Would the encapsulation have dramatic influence on what another immune system sees? As in what is the signal that a body picks up if it seems viral protein encapsulated within saliva vs mucus vs sputum vs fecal dust vs exosome (at least proven to be in Pfizer MRNA)
Can you follow what i'm saying until now? I'll proceed to the next point then. Sorry for being slow, I'm learning as much as I can and I appreciate someone holding my hand through it.
"It" would replicate - in other words, "it" literally is SARS-CoV-2 (or any other coronavirus "vaccine" that was idiotically designed to create antibodies against something else, like HIV).
So, that's not the same means as "mRNA-injection-induced exosome secondary vaccination," just the same ends. It seems plausible that someone wanted to "vaccinate the world against coronavirus" even without having to inject everyone, and when the first platform didn't pan out they released it to sell the second platform. It seems equally plausible the end-game of global vaccination was global ADE. However, I rate all this as not a strongly likely origin story since the end result is that even the designers get their immune systems busted.
"What is the signal" is indeed the pressing question. I keep returning to "allergic" IgE sensitization because "exosome vaccination" means antigen presenting cells do not have any viral contextual signals to pick up (DAMP pathways that detect cellular destruction, etc) so they will just think "ok, allergen."
Then the respiratory epithelium gets loaded up with receptor-bound IgE antibodies for spike. Then the virus comes along and you get cytokine storm from go.
so, f'ing up the natural (worked for eons) immune process so that we go into self-damaging mode disaster mode immediately? Isn't that what has been happening with all these vaccinations and antibiotics for the past century? (all the auto immune diseases?) or am I misunderstanding?
It's obviously complex since not all viruses are alike - otherwise you would be able to say, well if nothing bad came from the polio vaccine, escape-mutant-wise, than every kind of vaccine is hunky-dory; or, if things are going so badly with coronavirus, we should be able to find disaster results from every vaccine ever.
But we know that coronavirus vaccines all flunk in animal trials for ADE. Here is a reallllllly damning one from 2019 that JJ Couey recently highlighted - https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/labs/pmc/articles/PMC6478436/ - "In SARS-CoV/macaque models, we determined that anti–spike IgG (S-IgG), in productively infected lungs, causes severe ALI [acute lung injury] by skewing inflammation-resolving response."
https://www.historyofvaccines.org/timeline#EVT_100351 was the big failure. Salk's vaccine also went out of use since it didn't stop transmission and could "revert to live" during manufacture at any point - since it was injected instead of ingested, this resulted in outbreaks of severe cases. And my conspiracy theory on the post-1987 vaccine is that it "works" because it is literally just poliovirus - which never was that harmful to begin with until 1944. But I haven't done enough research into post-80s vaccines.
You mentioned cytokine storm initiated by that mechanism and I wondered why there was a very strange signal in UK Zoe App Symptoms tracker for users.
The Single Dosed folks suppressed every single symptom compared to the unvaccinated except two which was higher than unvaccinated: Sneezing and Shortness of Breath.
I think you might be on to something. I have my own intuition, but I know too little about immunology to make any inference.
I did notice that when we sleep, and we have a persistent source of something that the body considers a toxin (say a fan drying up your nasal airway enough to allow viral replication to start) then it will literally block the nostril completely to the point were we can't even breath but it won't wake us up or sneeze etc.
Circling back to Mucosal immunity, I have this intuition that getting any kind of immune recognition of progressive pathogenesis of Covid infection couldn't possibly be dismissed a-priori as negative. In fact, I think it's the most important thing we are missing, and you suggested that a spike protein exposure has more downside than up. I do think it could have downside but I do not know for sure how if we don't even know if this kind exposure happens at all.
For example: I'm convinced but happy to be proven wrong, that the transmission between two vaccinated persons in cohabitation will be higher, and multifold higher if what I think about mucusal immunity is right. I wouldn't happen as often between two unvaccinated and would be highest between partially vaccinated and fully vaccinated. I can't prove this, but I think some data does exist but is censored. Dutch study about transmission between people by vaccination status.
I'm curious why you think it's not desirable to have mucosal immunity in terms of slowing down evolution of the virus which can't be measured exactly but would result in fewer infections in my view.
Okay, one by one.
1. "This is the idea behind a self-spreading viral "coronavirus vaccine," and may be what SARS-CoV-2 was actually designed to be
Self-spreading but non-replicating?
How would it spread? If it spread, that would mean it would be replication competent no? and that would then involve an actual infection and T-cells and all.
What I had in mind is understanding would just having high levels of ambient but not acute exposure mean for a human upper respiratory tract and mouth as well. Would it be like being exposed to multiple viral proteins but not a whole virus being expelled from someone's body? Would the encapsulation have dramatic influence on what another immune system sees? As in what is the signal that a body picks up if it seems viral protein encapsulated within saliva vs mucus vs sputum vs fecal dust vs exosome (at least proven to be in Pfizer MRNA)
Can you follow what i'm saying until now? I'll proceed to the next point then. Sorry for being slow, I'm learning as much as I can and I appreciate someone holding my hand through it.
"It" would replicate - in other words, "it" literally is SARS-CoV-2 (or any other coronavirus "vaccine" that was idiotically designed to create antibodies against something else, like HIV).
So, that's not the same means as "mRNA-injection-induced exosome secondary vaccination," just the same ends. It seems plausible that someone wanted to "vaccinate the world against coronavirus" even without having to inject everyone, and when the first platform didn't pan out they released it to sell the second platform. It seems equally plausible the end-game of global vaccination was global ADE. However, I rate all this as not a strongly likely origin story since the end result is that even the designers get their immune systems busted.
"What is the signal" is indeed the pressing question. I keep returning to "allergic" IgE sensitization because "exosome vaccination" means antigen presenting cells do not have any viral contextual signals to pick up (DAMP pathways that detect cellular destruction, etc) so they will just think "ok, allergen."
Then the respiratory epithelium gets loaded up with receptor-bound IgE antibodies for spike. Then the virus comes along and you get cytokine storm from go.
so, f'ing up the natural (worked for eons) immune process so that we go into self-damaging mode disaster mode immediately? Isn't that what has been happening with all these vaccinations and antibiotics for the past century? (all the auto immune diseases?) or am I misunderstanding?
It's obviously complex since not all viruses are alike - otherwise you would be able to say, well if nothing bad came from the polio vaccine, escape-mutant-wise, than every kind of vaccine is hunky-dory; or, if things are going so badly with coronavirus, we should be able to find disaster results from every vaccine ever.
But we know that coronavirus vaccines all flunk in animal trials for ADE. Here is a reallllllly damning one from 2019 that JJ Couey recently highlighted - https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/labs/pmc/articles/PMC6478436/ - "In SARS-CoV/macaque models, we determined that anti–spike IgG (S-IgG), in productively infected lungs, causes severe ALI [acute lung injury] by skewing inflammation-resolving response."
Also, I've read that the first Polio vaccine had to be pulled because it killed and paralyzed so many people.
Further illustrating your point that not all vaccines are alike, since the second one seemed to work better.
https://www.historyofvaccines.org/timeline#EVT_100351 was the big failure. Salk's vaccine also went out of use since it didn't stop transmission and could "revert to live" during manufacture at any point - since it was injected instead of ingested, this resulted in outbreaks of severe cases. And my conspiracy theory on the post-1987 vaccine is that it "works" because it is literally just poliovirus - which never was that harmful to begin with until 1944. But I haven't done enough research into post-80s vaccines.
very cool! TY
😯
Intriguing, do you know if someone who is sleeping ever sneezes?
Google says no.
What do you think it means, in terms of inference we could draw about involvement of infection blocking or infection attack rates?
The sneezing? I don't think sneezing has a prominent role in spreading respiratory viruses...
Isn't coughing more efficient and aerodynamic?
You mentioned cytokine storm initiated by that mechanism and I wondered why there was a very strange signal in UK Zoe App Symptoms tracker for users.
The Single Dosed folks suppressed every single symptom compared to the unvaccinated except two which was higher than unvaccinated: Sneezing and Shortness of Breath.
I think you might be on to something. I have my own intuition, but I know too little about immunology to make any inference.
I did notice that when we sleep, and we have a persistent source of something that the body considers a toxin (say a fan drying up your nasal airway enough to allow viral replication to start) then it will literally block the nostril completely to the point were we can't even breath but it won't wake us up or sneeze etc.
Circling back to Mucosal immunity, I have this intuition that getting any kind of immune recognition of progressive pathogenesis of Covid infection couldn't possibly be dismissed a-priori as negative. In fact, I think it's the most important thing we are missing, and you suggested that a spike protein exposure has more downside than up. I do think it could have downside but I do not know for sure how if we don't even know if this kind exposure happens at all.
For example: I'm convinced but happy to be proven wrong, that the transmission between two vaccinated persons in cohabitation will be higher, and multifold higher if what I think about mucusal immunity is right. I wouldn't happen as often between two unvaccinated and would be highest between partially vaccinated and fully vaccinated. I can't prove this, but I think some data does exist but is censored. Dutch study about transmission between people by vaccination status.
I'm curious why you think it's not desirable to have mucosal immunity in terms of slowing down evolution of the virus which can't be measured exactly but would result in fewer infections in my view.
There seems to be a flaw in that statement. I just can't quite put my finger on it. Give me a minute....😛