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Rikard's avatar

Endless reproduction would hamper any such effort in earnest, by siphoning off resources no matter what policies you are willing to enact for crowd control.

But guided sterilisation, eugenics/genetical manipulation of the human brain (say implanting the gene that gives some species of birds a brain with as many or more folds as ours), and the dying off of those deemed unnecessry except as raw materials is an idea that originates in the mid-19th century, approximately.

Plato would be so proud.

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Guttermouth's avatar

If they just LEFT US THE FUCK ALONE family size would naturally settle into a Pareto-optimal one based on people's economic situations and life goals. The fact that we are being endlessly pushed and pulled to be nothing more than breeders or anti-breeders for someone's agenda means this is all academic.

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Gica Hagi's avatar

100% agree.

I admire people who can summarize thoughts so well in written form.

I am also a bit jelous since for me it is quite dificult sometimes since english is not my native language.

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Guttermouth's avatar

I wish we were RL proximate, I'd happily give lessons. One of my favorite jobs has been teaching already articulate and educated people to be equally fluent in English.

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Rikard's avatar

If you haven't already, I really recommend checking out Guttermouth's stack The Gutter.

One day it's chicken guts and pig shit, the next it's heavy-duty philosophy/statecraft, then maybe a poll about exactly whatever.

Good fun, educational, and free speech.

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Gica Hagi's avatar

I dunno, it sounds like one of those places where you might never make it out. Ah well, Imma just check it out then. Just a quick look, what can go wrong, right? ;)

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Guttermouth's avatar

And jokes about your mom.

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Rikard's avatar

Shorter:

That's Sweden in the period from 1950s to 1990s: Pareto-optimal.

Net births/replenishment numbers were steady at right above the 2.0X mark, mortality was dropping, and the percentage of elders as a part of the whole was rising.

So the argument was invented that we needed migration to take care of us when we get old.

Rather than accepting that it would be maybe a decade, two at most, with care for elders being a hefty cut of the budget, we started migration that now has a net cost of over 2% of GDP/cap, and that's the low-end estimate.

Longer:

The Socialist Party was concerned that they were inching closer to losing power every election, since as people bootstrapped themselves via work they stopped voting socialist. The capitalists and bankers were concerned because while Sweden is largely owned by a dozen and a half banking/business-families (the Wallenberg-clan being prominent yet discreet) they feared the humungously bigger german competitors would simply buy them up or out, depriving them of power: better be a big pike in a small aquarium than a small one in the lake mentality.

And the intellectuals were riddled with "white liberal guilt", learned when they went to college in the US in the late 1960s. In an infamous incident in the early 1990s when an (attempted) serialkiller, himself of foreign origin, targeted migrants, the prime minister and his minister of migration visited a community centre in a suburb. Things got heated as the foreigners weren't as easily silenced as swedes were back then.

And she grabs the microphone and yells like a schoolmarm to rowdy toddlers: "Now, now, settle down. Let's all sing 'We Shall Overcome' together!"

Like that, and now here we are circling the drain.

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Guttermouth's avatar

Yeah. "Fortunately," the Danes seem to have noticed this problem already, flipped out, and are trying to reverse it.

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Rikard's avatar

For what it's worth, with us on one side and Germany on the other.

And the EU actively working to create a paramilitary division, combining both lawenforcement and military duties and under the direct control of the top echelon.

"Fear will keep the local systems in line..."

They are threatening Poland and Romania both with blockades, embargoes and worse because they 1) don't want to let in black africans and moslems and 2) are very vocal in pointing out what inevitably happens when you do: Sweden, Germany, France, Netherlands, Britain, Italy.

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Richard A's avatar

Societies, as they become wealthy have less and less children. I don't trust government enough to agree with them managing births AND birth control. They are even incompetent printing money (if you think that's accidental).let's shrink government down to before 9/11, they got in trouble even then

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