As a HCW who will most likely be losing my job over all this come Dec 4 (unless something changes) it's difficult to keep my nerve some days. There has been lots of crying, yelling, not sleeping over it all trying to stay strong and not give in. And I won't, I have a good support system but it's still hard and infuriating that after only 1 year at an amazing job I have to make this shitty choice because the government wants to play little lord fauntleroy. It feels lonely a lot of the time but places like this help when you see comments from others in the same boat or those of support.
I'm not gonna lie... we are in for some bad years. The way I have been approaching this nightmare in my own life is: It's better to suffer for a few years than to live the rest of my life in a dystopian hell hole where people are no longer allowed to make their own health choices and a government that can literally demand that we wear medical devices and get medical procedures and medicines that we don't need or want just by saying so. Thank you for your bravery Opaque. I promise that there are millions of people out here on your side and there will be a place for you somewhere no matter what happens. Stay strong. :)
Stay strong. It does suck to have to walk away from something important to you due to this nonsensical crap. But at the end of the day we only have one body and one immune system, and we don't know what this new gene therapy does to it long term.
Hang in there... Keep telling us how it's going. Help GATO know how he can tell us what's need for folks in your similar position, and how this crowd can help...
The FDA has never in its history denied the right of licensed health care practicioners to use an "approved" therapeutic agent for uses other than the specific FDA approval. Off label uses are permitted as long as there is informed consent and there is some evidence that the use is appropriate and there is a carefully documented care plan and follow up. This is good medicine anyway. The state does not have to mandate this. READ this document from the Attorney General of Nebraska
continue to scour the internet for support for your position.
play some of the song by artists who support you - "I will not comply" music - when you need a uplift, there a quite a few in different music genres.
pray, while you may "feels lonely a lot of the time" you are not, in fact, alone. you are in God and so are so many people who do not know how to reach out to you and tell you "We are on you side" but we are; I know zero HCW in my town (i know, weird) so I cannot tell them, so I tell you: I am with you!
I hope when the "parallel institutes" emerge you will recognize that that type of health care is the kind you always wanted to be a part of...it will come, patience.
You were created for a time such a this, trust Him.
Opaque Owl, stand strong, trust God and pray often. He didn't promised that bad things would never happen; he DID promise to be with you regardless of whether they do or don't.
Do not leave voluntarily. You must force them to fire you. If it comes down to them ambiguously escorting you out, get it on video like that California nurse did, and ask if you're being terminated and refused entry. I know they're currently saying refusing the shot is "cause," and you won't get UI, but if you leave of your own volition, you're giving up any future redress for wrongful termination.
I've had a 25-year career in healthcare that ended last month due to the vaccine mandate. I've had no doubt that the vaccine is not going in my body; I know that deep in my bones. And still, leaving the beloved nursing community I've worked with made me very sad and vulnerable that last week. Hang in there, there are so many of us going through the same thing. This online community has been wonderful, and I've found an unvaccinated community in my area that's been a godsend. Sending love to all of us who are navigating these unstable, propagandic times. I have a feeling there is something good over the horizon for us to build and be together. 💕
I am a registered nurse who was granted a religious exemption. I have very mixed feelings about it. Regardless, I am bedside when our surgeons do consent for whatever surgery we are doing and consent for the studies that the surgeons ask if the patients want to participate in. You had better believe that I put my two cents in when it comes to the consents. I stress that no matter what their decision is, nothing changes - we will still help them and take care of them no matter what - they are truly free to choose.
People need to understand that that should be true across the board.
I am sorry this is happening. I have no idea how long our exemptions will be good for.
The vaxxed need to hear this: their ability to work and shop will only be good for as long as they are willing to jump through ever higher hoops. I hope they enjoy what they have done.
Could you tell us how your religious exemption worked and how your process went? CMS is mandating that all facilities billing Medicare, which is literally every hospital in the nation, have all patient-facing staff vaccinated. They are getting license numbers, NPIs and SS numbers and the bureaucracy is gearing up to enforce this in the coming months. Just wanting to know for colleagues. I decided to get the Moderna vaccines last spring and thankfully no issues, but I also do not know if they will want annual boosters into perpetuity to remain licensed.
Sue - I am convinced it had nothing to do with what I said. Instead, I believe that someone up high in our medical center has a firm grasp on reality and did not see the need to keep digging the hole they are in even deeper. We are chronically short nurses but it is much worse now. Lots of nurses have left to do travel nursing - the ones who complied, the ones who did as they were told and got vaxxed - they left because they are free to go make 3 times the amount of money doing travel nursing.
So what will happen? I don’t know. No one does. But Sue-where do you draw the line? On what day in school were you taught that it was ethical to coerce someone into a medical intervention in pain of losing their job, their home, & health insurance? There is not a doctor or nurse in this country who does not know what happens to a person’s health when they are jobless and have no health insurance. But our professions backed this evil in overwhelming numbers.
Look. I know how to take care of patients. It’s what I do. I love doing it. We have wonderful patients. But I want the health care industry damaged so badly that we never dream of doing anything against a patient’s wishes ever again.
The exemptions policy is being left up to the individual organizations per CMS statement so some of it will be how generous with granting exemptions the organizations are
Hello I can deff help guide your friends get a religious exemption. They have that right under the 1964 civil rights act to not be discriminated Please email me at fresca1461@gmail.com
Opaque Owl - I am so sorry for what you're going through. Former HCW here...changed professions but I do understand how this must feel. I can't believe we are here....it is like all the thinking rational adults have left the planet. I hope people like you can build alternative (parallel) systems. There are lots of us that would pay for compassionate, human centered and rational care outside of this broken system. Obama broke our health care by design and we are reaping what he sowed. Take Good Care...try Melatonin for sleep. ;)
Damn this sucks. Thoughts and prayers to you. I will never forgive these people. Maybe God will. Hopefully this only lasts until the deaths pile up so high they can't ignore it.
Or will the Pied Piper be able to enchant the majority of the population to their own deaths? Jim Jones would be blushing now.
Something to consider, if you have accumulated a fair amount of PTO, put in your notice to leave before Dec 4. Would NOT reference the jab at all in your resignation letter, just say you are leaving. It's none of their business why and it doesn't need to be in writing in your (permanent) HR file.
If every staff member gave notice (2 - 4 wks. depending upon your classification), it will have a dramatic affect on the hospital financials due to the PAYOUT of accumulated PTO.
Otherwise, some institutions allow you to lose your PTO if fired for "just cause."
The problem with this plan is for any redress or rehire should all of this get court vacated. I want to maintain the ability to have the company remain liable for unlawful termination should the opportunity present.
Do see your point but that is also why I would not give the shot as the reason you're leaving.
Most hospital systems will reinstate you with previous years earned, upon rehire (as far as PTO earned).
Something I learned from Viva Frei and Robert Barnes, litigation is expensive and many people are led to believe a lot of suits are settled for big bucks, when in fact, it's more like pennies. It's a gamble especially since we can't trust courts either.
And I'm not in it, so it's a lot easier for me to talk. But what it does do, is put more money in your pocket than if you were fired. It also brings the number crunchers (CPA's and board of directors) directly into the fight.
If they have to payout PTO, say three weeks average for 10% of their staff, then they have to increase OVERTIME due to staff shortage, pay outsourcing agencies (which will be your hourly wage doubled, at least), it won't take long before they back down (AKA Southwest Airlines lost $75 million due to the bad weather and caved).
"they WANT these systems to break. they want a hospital crisis because that will create “an emergency” that allows them to step in and regulate or grab control or nationalize."
Yes. Dialectic alchemy. The religious obsession of the modern statist.
Anyway, do you know of any good actions to take (or avoid taking) to support/be there for health care workers? This field is foreign to me.
As a healthcare worker who will probably be losing their job on Dec 4 unless the tides turn before then, if you have resources for work, even if it's temporary (have a business, know friends with businesses who could use help, etc) that you can pass along to HCWs I know for myself that would be very helpful.
There has to be a physician in your area that is willing to write letters for those who need a medical exemption. My daughter luckily found one and her company accepted it. She has to test twice weekly (on their nickel which is good) and send the results to HR. She loves her job also and stuck to her guns which I am very proud of her for doing. Look around- there are letters you can submit for religious exemption also. She filled out both. Most of her co-workers caved and got the shot. She was relentlessly coerced into getting it by higher-ups. Do not comply!
I am very interested too. I am waiting to see if any doctor advertises him/herself as unvaccinated tolerant and I will definitely go to see him. It’s been 19th month since I went to the doctor and it was to deliver my son, so lets figure, no luck yet.
I just went to my GP for my yearly physical. We never discussed vax until the very end. Doc: are you going to?? Me: no, sorry. Doc: (VERY nicely) keeping politics out of it, I just got my booster - it’s science. Me: I’m waiting for long term results. And I don’t believe in mandates. Doc: smiled beneath his mask. In my heart, he was not a vax Nazi and I think he believes in choice. He’s forced to cooperate with a local hospital system, who would put the vax in their drinking water if they could. I feel good with my GP, he respects my wishes. One in a million…..
Same with my doc in my yearly exam a week ago. She asked if I'd gotten the vax and I said no, I don't plan to. She just said "Well, if you change your mind let me know", and that was it. No lectures or cajoling, thank goodness. She's Catholic and had previously said there was no way she'd get the J&J.
I know it's splitting hairs, and some people are triggered by the notion of "socialism," but nationalization is when the government seizes control of resources for the benefit of the people, Libya under Gaddafi being an ideal example. This is not what's happening. Via their control of congress, private business has used Medicare as a Trojan horse to consolidate control of the healthcare industry. Hospitals and clinics are so dependent on Medicare, they have no choice but comply.
They're working furiously to sabotage the post office, and social security so they can privatize them, they're not going to simultaneously nationalize the healthcare system. They're going several steps further here and actively dismantling infrastructure in preparation for their Agenda21/2030 Great Reset.
It seems we are approaching that "dark winter" Brandon kept referring to during the election. I plan to do everything I can to stay away from hospitals for the foreseeable future. Airlines too.
But, but, Newsom has told everyone in CA to get the booster. Which means that even though the winter surge will be at least as bad as last year, we get to hear in every newspaper that it would have been so much worse. And almost everyone I know will believe it. Get me outta here.
The weather really can’t be beat here in SoCal, but we are seriously thinking of taking one of these unsolicited “all cash offers” for our house, quitting our daily-masking and weekly-testing-required jobs, and going elsewhere. Everyone I know with children of school age is considering the same. It’s so sad.
Carrots - same here in Washington state. And how can our gov have kept us under a state mask mandate for so long? I think I'm possibly near losing my mind.
I just heard from a work colleague yesterday, her 2 year old is heading to nursery and she has to mask up. When has society ever been so demented that it burdens the children so that adults caring for them can feel a little more comfortable about an infinitesimal risk?
It’s beyond frustrating to try to have rational, reasoned conversations with what I would consider normally-intelligent people. They are all about the mandates to keep themselves safe. And I ask, “But you know masks and vaccines don’t stop infection or spread, right?” Blank stare, followed by, “But they keep people from going into hospital and dying.”
“Yes, but so does taking the right amount of insulin if diabetic, or taking statins for cardiovascular disease, or psychiatric meds for schizophrenia, all of those things keep people from going to hospital
We are heading to SLC. See you there carrots. And you know what, perhaps I am sour grapesing but the California weather is kind of a monoseason and I could use a bit more fall colors anyway.
Eric, enjoy SLC! I’m originally from Idaho, graduated from Utah State. Hubby is born and raised So Cal native, but even he’s starting to see a paucity of hope for his birthplace.
I was worried about retiring early due to medical care and insurance costs, but if I can’t access the medical system anyway as a dirty unvaccinated leper, I guess I’ll just not spend money on an insurance plan.
Lots of our friends with young children have either moved out of Sacramento to the Sierra foothills (less masking) or out of Cali altogether.
We are still here because of my elderly parents, but if/when my wife's exemption is thrown out, we will have to move, like it or not, this is a medical diaspora from the "blue" (truly fascist) states.
Hello I can deff help guide you to get a religious exemption. You have that right under the 1964 civil rights act to not be discriminated Please email me at fresca1461@gmail.com
I HATE IT HERE. I’m trapped in So Cal: our crappy little $270k house would sell for well over $800k today, but husband’s job is here, as is both of our entire extended families. We’re all natives here, but feeling like strangers in our own (crappy but expensive) home.
I shudder to think what’s going to happen if any of us actually NEEDS a hospital with decent care. However, we support CHOICE, and have long applauded the brave hospital workers who have refused flu vaccines in the past and were stuck in masks (that don’t work).
Why won’t the Fates take Newsom?? (Will this question put me on a government list somewhere? 🤯)
Sell the house, use the profits to move somewhere cheap. You should sell it while you still can. I got the hell out of CA in August, 2020, because I saw the writing on the wall. You are another test case like Australia.
Agree completely. No one's foot is actually nailed to the floor - we all still have freedom of choice of where to live. If you value your comfort / home / job more than your children then you need to re-evaluate your life. I have a friend in CA and as her kids are in masks in a private school I bluntly said, 'what you have is a location problem.' Writing from central Kentucky where life is normal and people are not insane.
Yes, we should…but EVERYONE we love is here. Including parents in their 80s who will need care before long. That’s the problem. That, and the job (husband is two years short of full retirement—we do need to be able to eat).
That might not solve anything. New York managed to hustle out Gov. Cuomo, a total imbecile, only to have the role taken by an even bigger idiot and jab fanatic.
Maybe everyone in your family is saying the same or thinking it? Maybe you can find out who will leave if you leave.... Thankfully my elderly parents even left April 2020. I'm so thankful. There's tons of family still there. Many are in on the game, and won't talk to me anymore. I don't care!? As it demonstrates in Bhagavad Gita, sometimes you find family on the opposing side. Stay focused. Uphold your ideals.
Absolutely agree. Don’t feel good about wishing ill on anyone, but wasn’t sad when I heard the rumor that Newsom may have had vax injury resulting in Bells Palsy. The thought of him doing his incessant narcissistic oily speeches with a half-droopy face.... well.... it just didn’t make sad.
Before considering taking the vaccine, especially for the young and healthy, read the following obituary. Yes, it is an actual obituary from a funeral home website. I'm sure this is an outliner but our 3 letter agencies are definitely downplaying the elevated and real adverse event risks as compared to traditional vaccines.
Mike was adamant that people know what happened to him that caused his early and unexpected death. Message from Mike: “Many nurses and non-nursing staff begged me and my wife to get the truth out to the public about the Covid-19 vaccines because the truth of deaths from the vaccine was being hidden within the medical profession. I promised I would get the message out. So, here is my message: I was afraid of getting the vaccine for fear that I might die. At the insistence of my doctor, I gave in to pressure to get vaccinated. On August 17th I received the Moderna vaccine and starting feeling ill three days later. I never recovered but continued to get worse. I developed multisystem inflammation and multisystem failure that medical professionals could not stop. My muscles disappeared as if to disintegrate. I was in ICU for several weeks and stabbed with needles up to 24 times a day for those several weeks, while also receiving 6 or 7 IVs at the same time (continuously). It was constant torture that I cannot describe. I was no longer treated as a human with feelings and a life. I was nothing more than a covid vaccine human guinea pig and the doctors excited to participate in my fascinating progression unto death. If you want to know more, please ask my wife. I wished I would have never gotten vaccinated. If you are not vaccinated, don’t do it unless you are ready to suffer and die.”
I am also one of the “evil” healthcare workers who is refusing the vaxx. I’m hoping my exemption outlasts the mandate. Fingers crossed. It’s all about the Benjamins. The hospitals will not risk losing reimbursement- they will fire whoever they have to.
Thank you. So many sane docs and nurses are terrified of speaking out due to threats from licensing orgs or consequences of deviating from CDC/FDA narrative. They need our support. On the other hand, you would be foolish to trust the medical blind believers. Change docs if you need to.
Bad cat, this is so spot on. And not only do we have risk from a government caused HCW shortage, but also our blood supply. Making a request- would you be interested in looking into what is going on with the nation's blood supply? I heard that California is taking blood from everyone, mRNA vaxxed or not, while some other states are only accepting donations from the unvaxxed. Is this true? What will the repercussions be? And what can we do about it, those of us who are in the control group and wish to remain so, but who might have scheduled surgeries, or emergencies, where we might need blood? Is this even an issue? I trust your kitty friends investigatory skills, so I hope to find out soon.
yes, this is possible, but- will insurance cover it, because you know, we 'mericans don't pay out of pocket for medical expenses anymore? And what about unforeseen accidents?
These mandates around the world are illegal and they know it. As Gato said, they are power grabs. What if all the HCW who don't like to be mandated, band together to form new "pop up" hospitals? Helping the soon to be influx of patients. Perhaps donations from the various Drs and health professionals speaking out against the shots can all pool some money to help buy supplies. As for the HCW that losing your jobs you love, i know it's scary and unfair and heartbreaking. I've been in the same situation- now I work on a farm to pay the bills. It doesnt stop you from still doing what you love and helping people. Your still a health care professional- so care for people, by taking care of you, sticking to your oaths and find another way/outlet to do your work. In society, when the rules are stupid and dangerous, we are obligated as citizen's, to ignore/push back on the unjust/illegal rules (which mandates aren't even rules-they are requests).
I remember seeing a tweet by Simone Gold of America's Frontline Doctors asking if people would be interested in direct pay, patient driven medical clinics. I have a feeling things are brewing behind the scenes, but no overt information that I can find. I did start researching direct primary care in my area, and there are not many options yet. I also have watched some videos by Pam Popper who conducts weekly meetings for people in the health industry who want out of the current health system.
I'm sure "they" are going to try and stop any alternatives, but if there's enough of us, it will be nearly impossible for them to do so. What I pay for, who I pay and how I pay is no one's business if you get my drift ;-). Moving forward, I would rather sign a waiver to give immunity to a great nurse to help me "under the table" than to go to one of these hellish medical establishments that are forcing treatments, denying treatments etc. I will take my chances like my Grandparents did on both sides of my family who lived very long lives WITHOUT going to the doc for every sniffle. Stay healthy best I can and leave the rest up to my belief system.
creating an alternate healthcare scene would be a dream. I've been scouring the interwebs for concierge and other physical therapy options that aren't part of the traditional system...if anyone knows anything point me to it
I'm going to cancel my gender transition surgery in protest if the hospital where it is scheduled is going to follow through on this. Instead, I'll go to YouTube and figure out how to do it myself.
The message in this article is so spot on. The goal is to keep the emergency going. This isn’t about public health or improving patient outcomes. In fact it does more harm.
I had surgery on Monday. Under State and Federal Law, I signed a statement that I have the right to be informed of my health status, being involved in care planning and treatment, and being able to request or refuse treatment.
Astounding that this doesn't apply to a vaccine which is non-sterilizing and doesn't prevent transmission either.
There's also medium term epidemiological reasons for healthcare professionals to hold out that's clearly in the interest of their patients and the ambulatory population outside, not just themselves.
They recently demonstrated resistant variants showing convergent evolution from drug pressure (remdesivir in this case, but can be anything, molnupivir, ivermectin, Chloroquine etc) in immunocompromised.
This matters because while the mutation may have a fitness cost in the unvaccinated, if its allowed serial passaging through vaccinated patients facing vaccinated doctors and vaccinated nurses, it will easily acquire the mutations to offset this cost and gain general fitness that would have been impossible if a healthy mix of unvaccinated patients and healthcare workers were composing much of the stocking density in hospital setting.
In short: If you vaccinate, you are much more likely to create the conditions along with your colleagues to pass resistant strains developing from drug therapy in immunocompromised, to other vaccinees and the virus cab develop mutations to resist vaccines. You will then pass on this adaptation to the world outside making both the drugs and the vaccines useless.
"In short, such detailed analysis of viral genomes identified the emergence of mutation harboring remdesivir resistance, known as E802D, which arose in the immunocompromised patient with persistent SARS-CoV-2 infection. More specifically, using patient specimens, the occurrence of the mutation has been temporally linked to the treatment with this drug."
Btw, not suggesting at all that healthcare professions have to rely on altruistic or strategic framing to justify their decisions any more than they have to justify getting circumcised to protect their circumcised patients from AIDS. Of course, there is no room to compel someone to do anything regardless of utilitarian/consequentialist calculus dreamt up by experts and epidemiologists on the fly.
I just wanted to present a perfectly rational reason for someone to be both looking out for their own interest and their patients + future susceptible.
Vaccinating healthcare workers with symptom suppressors will not wind down the pandemic but ratchet it up. And they will find this out the hard way when the unvaccinated are removed from the spaces and they see uncontrolled run-offs of hyperpathogenic mutants that get a free ride.
You don't remove the graphite rods and expect to control nuclear fission. You create explosions.
As a HCW who will most likely be losing my job over all this come Dec 4 (unless something changes) it's difficult to keep my nerve some days. There has been lots of crying, yelling, not sleeping over it all trying to stay strong and not give in. And I won't, I have a good support system but it's still hard and infuriating that after only 1 year at an amazing job I have to make this shitty choice because the government wants to play little lord fauntleroy. It feels lonely a lot of the time but places like this help when you see comments from others in the same boat or those of support.
I'm not gonna lie... we are in for some bad years. The way I have been approaching this nightmare in my own life is: It's better to suffer for a few years than to live the rest of my life in a dystopian hell hole where people are no longer allowed to make their own health choices and a government that can literally demand that we wear medical devices and get medical procedures and medicines that we don't need or want just by saying so. Thank you for your bravery Opaque. I promise that there are millions of people out here on your side and there will be a place for you somewhere no matter what happens. Stay strong. :)
I 2nd you Rob!
Stay strong. It does suck to have to walk away from something important to you due to this nonsensical crap. But at the end of the day we only have one body and one immune system, and we don't know what this new gene therapy does to it long term.
I don't like the term "gene therapy". Gene modification perhaps?
Hang in there... Keep telling us how it's going. Help GATO know how he can tell us what's need for folks in your similar position, and how this crowd can help...
The FDA has never in its history denied the right of licensed health care practicioners to use an "approved" therapeutic agent for uses other than the specific FDA approval. Off label uses are permitted as long as there is informed consent and there is some evidence that the use is appropriate and there is a carefully documented care plan and follow up. This is good medicine anyway. The state does not have to mandate this. READ this document from the Attorney General of Nebraska
https://ago.nebraska.gov/sites/ago.nebraska.gov/files/docs/opinions/21-017_0.pdf
But we all know why this is happening. Do "they" think we are so obtuse?
https://c19early.com/
continue to scour the internet for support for your position.
play some of the song by artists who support you - "I will not comply" music - when you need a uplift, there a quite a few in different music genres.
pray, while you may "feels lonely a lot of the time" you are not, in fact, alone. you are in God and so are so many people who do not know how to reach out to you and tell you "We are on you side" but we are; I know zero HCW in my town (i know, weird) so I cannot tell them, so I tell you: I am with you!
I hope when the "parallel institutes" emerge you will recognize that that type of health care is the kind you always wanted to be a part of...it will come, patience.
You were created for a time such a this, trust Him.
Amen to that, Amy.
Opaque Owl, stand strong, trust God and pray often. He didn't promised that bad things would never happen; he DID promise to be with you regardless of whether they do or don't.
Yes, like the various rap song forms of Let's Go Brandon. Also at least one rap song now (excuse the language) that's anti-vac by Cole Beasley.
Opaque - I'm so sorry for this total disrespect you are experiencing.
Do not leave voluntarily. You must force them to fire you. If it comes down to them ambiguously escorting you out, get it on video like that California nurse did, and ask if you're being terminated and refused entry. I know they're currently saying refusing the shot is "cause," and you won't get UI, but if you leave of your own volition, you're giving up any future redress for wrongful termination.
Some states like Nebraska pay unemployment over this, as rightly they should
Good Point!
I've had a 25-year career in healthcare that ended last month due to the vaccine mandate. I've had no doubt that the vaccine is not going in my body; I know that deep in my bones. And still, leaving the beloved nursing community I've worked with made me very sad and vulnerable that last week. Hang in there, there are so many of us going through the same thing. This online community has been wonderful, and I've found an unvaccinated community in my area that's been a godsend. Sending love to all of us who are navigating these unstable, propagandic times. I have a feeling there is something good over the horizon for us to build and be together. 💕
If they beg you to come back, because all of the others are sick, make sure they give you a higher wage!
I am a registered nurse who was granted a religious exemption. I have very mixed feelings about it. Regardless, I am bedside when our surgeons do consent for whatever surgery we are doing and consent for the studies that the surgeons ask if the patients want to participate in. You had better believe that I put my two cents in when it comes to the consents. I stress that no matter what their decision is, nothing changes - we will still help them and take care of them no matter what - they are truly free to choose.
People need to understand that that should be true across the board.
I am sorry this is happening. I have no idea how long our exemptions will be good for.
The vaxxed need to hear this: their ability to work and shop will only be good for as long as they are willing to jump through ever higher hoops. I hope they enjoy what they have done.
Could you tell us how your religious exemption worked and how your process went? CMS is mandating that all facilities billing Medicare, which is literally every hospital in the nation, have all patient-facing staff vaccinated. They are getting license numbers, NPIs and SS numbers and the bureaucracy is gearing up to enforce this in the coming months. Just wanting to know for colleagues. I decided to get the Moderna vaccines last spring and thankfully no issues, but I also do not know if they will want annual boosters into perpetuity to remain licensed.
Sue - I am convinced it had nothing to do with what I said. Instead, I believe that someone up high in our medical center has a firm grasp on reality and did not see the need to keep digging the hole they are in even deeper. We are chronically short nurses but it is much worse now. Lots of nurses have left to do travel nursing - the ones who complied, the ones who did as they were told and got vaxxed - they left because they are free to go make 3 times the amount of money doing travel nursing.
So what will happen? I don’t know. No one does. But Sue-where do you draw the line? On what day in school were you taught that it was ethical to coerce someone into a medical intervention in pain of losing their job, their home, & health insurance? There is not a doctor or nurse in this country who does not know what happens to a person’s health when they are jobless and have no health insurance. But our professions backed this evil in overwhelming numbers.
Look. I know how to take care of patients. It’s what I do. I love doing it. We have wonderful patients. But I want the health care industry damaged so badly that we never dream of doing anything against a patient’s wishes ever again.
The exemptions policy is being left up to the individual organizations per CMS statement so some of it will be how generous with granting exemptions the organizations are
Hello I can deff help guide your friends get a religious exemption. They have that right under the 1964 civil rights act to not be discriminated Please email me at fresca1461@gmail.com
Stay strong, truth is more important and truth will win out in the end. I wish you good luck and strength.
Thank you for staying strong!
Opaque Owl - I am so sorry for what you're going through. Former HCW here...changed professions but I do understand how this must feel. I can't believe we are here....it is like all the thinking rational adults have left the planet. I hope people like you can build alternative (parallel) systems. There are lots of us that would pay for compassionate, human centered and rational care outside of this broken system. Obama broke our health care by design and we are reaping what he sowed. Take Good Care...try Melatonin for sleep. ;)
Better poor and alive, than dead by the vaxx.
You are a hero OO and don't you forget it. WE all know it and want you to know it, live it, love it, believe it and don't give up or in!
Damn this sucks. Thoughts and prayers to you. I will never forgive these people. Maybe God will. Hopefully this only lasts until the deaths pile up so high they can't ignore it.
Or will the Pied Piper be able to enchant the majority of the population to their own deaths? Jim Jones would be blushing now.
My best wishes to you! This poor HCW got effed over: https://rumble.com/vozjhl-grieving-mother-who-threatened-health-impact-news-for-publishing-daughters-.html
Something to consider, if you have accumulated a fair amount of PTO, put in your notice to leave before Dec 4. Would NOT reference the jab at all in your resignation letter, just say you are leaving. It's none of their business why and it doesn't need to be in writing in your (permanent) HR file.
If every staff member gave notice (2 - 4 wks. depending upon your classification), it will have a dramatic affect on the hospital financials due to the PAYOUT of accumulated PTO.
Otherwise, some institutions allow you to lose your PTO if fired for "just cause."
The problem with this plan is for any redress or rehire should all of this get court vacated. I want to maintain the ability to have the company remain liable for unlawful termination should the opportunity present.
Do see your point but that is also why I would not give the shot as the reason you're leaving.
Most hospital systems will reinstate you with previous years earned, upon rehire (as far as PTO earned).
Something I learned from Viva Frei and Robert Barnes, litigation is expensive and many people are led to believe a lot of suits are settled for big bucks, when in fact, it's more like pennies. It's a gamble especially since we can't trust courts either.
And I'm not in it, so it's a lot easier for me to talk. But what it does do, is put more money in your pocket than if you were fired. It also brings the number crunchers (CPA's and board of directors) directly into the fight.
If they have to payout PTO, say three weeks average for 10% of their staff, then they have to increase OVERTIME due to staff shortage, pay outsourcing agencies (which will be your hourly wage doubled, at least), it won't take long before they back down (AKA Southwest Airlines lost $75 million due to the bad weather and caved).
This!
"they WANT these systems to break. they want a hospital crisis because that will create “an emergency” that allows them to step in and regulate or grab control or nationalize."
Yes. Dialectic alchemy. The religious obsession of the modern statist.
Anyway, do you know of any good actions to take (or avoid taking) to support/be there for health care workers? This field is foreign to me.
As a healthcare worker who will probably be losing their job on Dec 4 unless the tides turn before then, if you have resources for work, even if it's temporary (have a business, know friends with businesses who could use help, etc) that you can pass along to HCWs I know for myself that would be very helpful.
There has to be a physician in your area that is willing to write letters for those who need a medical exemption. My daughter luckily found one and her company accepted it. She has to test twice weekly (on their nickel which is good) and send the results to HR. She loves her job also and stuck to her guns which I am very proud of her for doing. Look around- there are letters you can submit for religious exemption also. She filled out both. Most of her co-workers caved and got the shot. She was relentlessly coerced into getting it by higher-ups. Do not comply!
I am very interested too. I am waiting to see if any doctor advertises him/herself as unvaccinated tolerant and I will definitely go to see him. It’s been 19th month since I went to the doctor and it was to deliver my son, so lets figure, no luck yet.
I just went to my GP for my yearly physical. We never discussed vax until the very end. Doc: are you going to?? Me: no, sorry. Doc: (VERY nicely) keeping politics out of it, I just got my booster - it’s science. Me: I’m waiting for long term results. And I don’t believe in mandates. Doc: smiled beneath his mask. In my heart, he was not a vax Nazi and I think he believes in choice. He’s forced to cooperate with a local hospital system, who would put the vax in their drinking water if they could. I feel good with my GP, he respects my wishes. One in a million…..
Same with my doc in my yearly exam a week ago. She asked if I'd gotten the vax and I said no, I don't plan to. She just said "Well, if you change your mind let me know", and that was it. No lectures or cajoling, thank goodness. She's Catholic and had previously said there was no way she'd get the J&J.
Woo Hoo! There is hope. And there are docs out there, they just need to be VERY VERY careful……😃
I know it's splitting hairs, and some people are triggered by the notion of "socialism," but nationalization is when the government seizes control of resources for the benefit of the people, Libya under Gaddafi being an ideal example. This is not what's happening. Via their control of congress, private business has used Medicare as a Trojan horse to consolidate control of the healthcare industry. Hospitals and clinics are so dependent on Medicare, they have no choice but comply.
They're working furiously to sabotage the post office, and social security so they can privatize them, they're not going to simultaneously nationalize the healthcare system. They're going several steps further here and actively dismantling infrastructure in preparation for their Agenda21/2030 Great Reset.
"Dialectic alchemy." Gonna steal that.
I can't take credit. James Lindsay introduced me to the idea and I now see it everywhere in modern politics.
It seems we are approaching that "dark winter" Brandon kept referring to during the election. I plan to do everything I can to stay away from hospitals for the foreseeable future. Airlines too.
But, but, Newsom has told everyone in CA to get the booster. Which means that even though the winter surge will be at least as bad as last year, we get to hear in every newspaper that it would have been so much worse. And almost everyone I know will believe it. Get me outta here.
The weather really can’t be beat here in SoCal, but we are seriously thinking of taking one of these unsolicited “all cash offers” for our house, quitting our daily-masking and weekly-testing-required jobs, and going elsewhere. Everyone I know with children of school age is considering the same. It’s so sad.
Carrots - same here in Washington state. And how can our gov have kept us under a state mask mandate for so long? I think I'm possibly near losing my mind.
I just heard from a work colleague yesterday, her 2 year old is heading to nursery and she has to mask up. When has society ever been so demented that it burdens the children so that adults caring for them can feel a little more comfortable about an infinitesimal risk?
It’s beyond frustrating to try to have rational, reasoned conversations with what I would consider normally-intelligent people. They are all about the mandates to keep themselves safe. And I ask, “But you know masks and vaccines don’t stop infection or spread, right?” Blank stare, followed by, “But they keep people from going into hospital and dying.”
“Yes, but so does taking the right amount of insulin if diabetic, or taking statins for cardiovascular disease, or psychiatric meds for schizophrenia, all of those things keep people from going to hospital
And dying, yet we don’t federally mandate that.”
Blank Stare. “Are you an antivaxxer?”
Sigh.
not true about statins but rest looks good. Also, not being obese helps
Do not comply. Refuse to wear it. What are they going to do? Throw you in jail?
We are heading to SLC. See you there carrots. And you know what, perhaps I am sour grapesing but the California weather is kind of a monoseason and I could use a bit more fall colors anyway.
Eric, enjoy SLC! I’m originally from Idaho, graduated from Utah State. Hubby is born and raised So Cal native, but even he’s starting to see a paucity of hope for his birthplace.
I was worried about retiring early due to medical care and insurance costs, but if I can’t access the medical system anyway as a dirty unvaccinated leper, I guess I’ll just not spend money on an insurance plan.
I am in the same boat..
Lots of our friends with young children have either moved out of Sacramento to the Sierra foothills (less masking) or out of Cali altogether.
We are still here because of my elderly parents, but if/when my wife's exemption is thrown out, we will have to move, like it or not, this is a medical diaspora from the "blue" (truly fascist) states.
Hello I can deff help guide you to get a religious exemption. You have that right under the 1964 civil rights act to not be discriminated Please email me at fresca1461@gmail.com
If all the smart Californians leave the place, Newsom will be left with the grub
Which is truly all he should be left with, preferably camped in his yard and breaking into his house to take his food.
I HATE IT HERE. I’m trapped in So Cal: our crappy little $270k house would sell for well over $800k today, but husband’s job is here, as is both of our entire extended families. We’re all natives here, but feeling like strangers in our own (crappy but expensive) home.
I shudder to think what’s going to happen if any of us actually NEEDS a hospital with decent care. However, we support CHOICE, and have long applauded the brave hospital workers who have refused flu vaccines in the past and were stuck in masks (that don’t work).
Why won’t the Fates take Newsom?? (Will this question put me on a government list somewhere? 🤯)
Sell the house, use the profits to move somewhere cheap. You should sell it while you still can. I got the hell out of CA in August, 2020, because I saw the writing on the wall. You are another test case like Australia.
Agree completely. No one's foot is actually nailed to the floor - we all still have freedom of choice of where to live. If you value your comfort / home / job more than your children then you need to re-evaluate your life. I have a friend in CA and as her kids are in masks in a private school I bluntly said, 'what you have is a location problem.' Writing from central Kentucky where life is normal and people are not insane.
Well said. People tend to live in a bubble and don't realize there are plenty of places where life is still normal, and affordable, even.
What state did you choose Vida?
Idaho!
Yes, we should…but EVERYONE we love is here. Including parents in their 80s who will need care before long. That’s the problem. That, and the job (husband is two years short of full retirement—we do need to be able to eat).
We envy you for escaping.
Dang. Sorry you have such heavy ties. And this is obviously horrible timing with regard to people's retirements/pensions... ugh.
"Why won’t the Fates take Newsom??"
That might not solve anything. New York managed to hustle out Gov. Cuomo, a total imbecile, only to have the role taken by an even bigger idiot and jab fanatic.
The system is broken, the people in power are a facade.
Unfortunately, ill informed, inattentive, low information voters put them in power with either careless votes or by not voting at all.
They're like cockroaches....you get rid of one but there are many more to replace it.
This is 100% true…
Maybe everyone in your family is saying the same or thinking it? Maybe you can find out who will leave if you leave.... Thankfully my elderly parents even left April 2020. I'm so thankful. There's tons of family still there. Many are in on the game, and won't talk to me anymore. I don't care!? As it demonstrates in Bhagavad Gita, sometimes you find family on the opposing side. Stay focused. Uphold your ideals.
Absolutely agree. Don’t feel good about wishing ill on anyone, but wasn’t sad when I heard the rumor that Newsom may have had vax injury resulting in Bells Palsy. The thought of him doing his incessant narcissistic oily speeches with a half-droopy face.... well.... it just didn’t make sad.
For that price you have a mansion in Georgia! I don't even know if we have any house that price anywhere near LOL
Well, what we can sell it for and how much equity we have are two entirely different things. California is crazy-expensive, generally.
Even magazines cost a buck more than in other states !
Before considering taking the vaccine, especially for the young and healthy, read the following obituary. Yes, it is an actual obituary from a funeral home website. I'm sure this is an outliner but our 3 letter agencies are definitely downplaying the elevated and real adverse event risks as compared to traditional vaccines.
https://www.habingfamily.com/obituary/michael-mike-granata
Excerpt -
Mike was adamant that people know what happened to him that caused his early and unexpected death. Message from Mike: “Many nurses and non-nursing staff begged me and my wife to get the truth out to the public about the Covid-19 vaccines because the truth of deaths from the vaccine was being hidden within the medical profession. I promised I would get the message out. So, here is my message: I was afraid of getting the vaccine for fear that I might die. At the insistence of my doctor, I gave in to pressure to get vaccinated. On August 17th I received the Moderna vaccine and starting feeling ill three days later. I never recovered but continued to get worse. I developed multisystem inflammation and multisystem failure that medical professionals could not stop. My muscles disappeared as if to disintegrate. I was in ICU for several weeks and stabbed with needles up to 24 times a day for those several weeks, while also receiving 6 or 7 IVs at the same time (continuously). It was constant torture that I cannot describe. I was no longer treated as a human with feelings and a life. I was nothing more than a covid vaccine human guinea pig and the doctors excited to participate in my fascinating progression unto death. If you want to know more, please ask my wife. I wished I would have never gotten vaccinated. If you are not vaccinated, don’t do it unless you are ready to suffer and die.”
yes, thank you, I posted about it today, Gilroy, is half hour away from where I live, sooo sad and medical malpractice. hope family sues all of them.
I am also one of the “evil” healthcare workers who is refusing the vaxx. I’m hoping my exemption outlasts the mandate. Fingers crossed. It’s all about the Benjamins. The hospitals will not risk losing reimbursement- they will fire whoever they have to.
There is no expiration date for exemption. Ive helped many people get them please email me at fresca1461@gmail.com
It was NEVER about public health. They've been gaslighting us since the beginning…
Thank you. So many sane docs and nurses are terrified of speaking out due to threats from licensing orgs or consequences of deviating from CDC/FDA narrative. They need our support. On the other hand, you would be foolish to trust the medical blind believers. Change docs if you need to.
Bad cat, this is so spot on. And not only do we have risk from a government caused HCW shortage, but also our blood supply. Making a request- would you be interested in looking into what is going on with the nation's blood supply? I heard that California is taking blood from everyone, mRNA vaxxed or not, while some other states are only accepting donations from the unvaxxed. Is this true? What will the repercussions be? And what can we do about it, those of us who are in the control group and wish to remain so, but who might have scheduled surgeries, or emergencies, where we might need blood? Is this even an issue? I trust your kitty friends investigatory skills, so I hope to find out soon.
Been wondering about that too. Is that mRNA in transfusion blood? It must be right?
Donate your blood specifically for your surgery.
yes, this is possible, but- will insurance cover it, because you know, we 'mericans don't pay out of pocket for medical expenses anymore? And what about unforeseen accidents?
This is actually part of the reason I donate blood. I know I am helping someone with my unvaccinated blood.
Not sure our local blood center takes unvaccinated blood…
Wow.
These mandates around the world are illegal and they know it. As Gato said, they are power grabs. What if all the HCW who don't like to be mandated, band together to form new "pop up" hospitals? Helping the soon to be influx of patients. Perhaps donations from the various Drs and health professionals speaking out against the shots can all pool some money to help buy supplies. As for the HCW that losing your jobs you love, i know it's scary and unfair and heartbreaking. I've been in the same situation- now I work on a farm to pay the bills. It doesnt stop you from still doing what you love and helping people. Your still a health care professional- so care for people, by taking care of you, sticking to your oaths and find another way/outlet to do your work. In society, when the rules are stupid and dangerous, we are obligated as citizen's, to ignore/push back on the unjust/illegal rules (which mandates aren't even rules-they are requests).
#thankyouhcw #yourjobisnotyou #beahcwanyway
I remember seeing a tweet by Simone Gold of America's Frontline Doctors asking if people would be interested in direct pay, patient driven medical clinics. I have a feeling things are brewing behind the scenes, but no overt information that I can find. I did start researching direct primary care in my area, and there are not many options yet. I also have watched some videos by Pam Popper who conducts weekly meetings for people in the health industry who want out of the current health system.
https://wellnessforumhealth.com/
I'm sure "they" are going to try and stop any alternatives, but if there's enough of us, it will be nearly impossible for them to do so. What I pay for, who I pay and how I pay is no one's business if you get my drift ;-). Moving forward, I would rather sign a waiver to give immunity to a great nurse to help me "under the table" than to go to one of these hellish medical establishments that are forcing treatments, denying treatments etc. I will take my chances like my Grandparents did on both sides of my family who lived very long lives WITHOUT going to the doc for every sniffle. Stay healthy best I can and leave the rest up to my belief system.
creating an alternate healthcare scene would be a dream. I've been scouring the interwebs for concierge and other physical therapy options that aren't part of the traditional system...if anyone knows anything point me to it
https://wellnessforumhealth.com/
They are going to blow up the healthcare system we all 'had' to stay home for 18 months to protect.
I'm going to cancel my gender transition surgery in protest if the hospital where it is scheduled is going to follow through on this. Instead, I'll go to YouTube and figure out how to do it myself.
Bwahahahaha. And I would almost bet the directions are there somewhere.
The message in this article is so spot on. The goal is to keep the emergency going. This isn’t about public health or improving patient outcomes. In fact it does more harm.
I had surgery on Monday. Under State and Federal Law, I signed a statement that I have the right to be informed of my health status, being involved in care planning and treatment, and being able to request or refuse treatment.
Astounding that this doesn't apply to a vaccine which is non-sterilizing and doesn't prevent transmission either.
There's also medium term epidemiological reasons for healthcare professionals to hold out that's clearly in the interest of their patients and the ambulatory population outside, not just themselves.
They recently demonstrated resistant variants showing convergent evolution from drug pressure (remdesivir in this case, but can be anything, molnupivir, ivermectin, Chloroquine etc) in immunocompromised.
This matters because while the mutation may have a fitness cost in the unvaccinated, if its allowed serial passaging through vaccinated patients facing vaccinated doctors and vaccinated nurses, it will easily acquire the mutations to offset this cost and gain general fitness that would have been impossible if a healthy mix of unvaccinated patients and healthcare workers were composing much of the stocking density in hospital setting.
In short: If you vaccinate, you are much more likely to create the conditions along with your colleagues to pass resistant strains developing from drug therapy in immunocompromised, to other vaccinees and the virus cab develop mutations to resist vaccines. You will then pass on this adaptation to the world outside making both the drugs and the vaccines useless.
https://www.news-medical.net/news/20211110/First-detection-of-SARS-CoV-2-remdesivir-resistance-in-an-immunocompromised-patient.aspx
"In short, such detailed analysis of viral genomes identified the emergence of mutation harboring remdesivir resistance, known as E802D, which arose in the immunocompromised patient with persistent SARS-CoV-2 infection. More specifically, using patient specimens, the occurrence of the mutation has been temporally linked to the treatment with this drug."
Btw, not suggesting at all that healthcare professions have to rely on altruistic or strategic framing to justify their decisions any more than they have to justify getting circumcised to protect their circumcised patients from AIDS. Of course, there is no room to compel someone to do anything regardless of utilitarian/consequentialist calculus dreamt up by experts and epidemiologists on the fly.
I just wanted to present a perfectly rational reason for someone to be both looking out for their own interest and their patients + future susceptible.
Vaccinating healthcare workers with symptom suppressors will not wind down the pandemic but ratchet it up. And they will find this out the hard way when the unvaccinated are removed from the spaces and they see uncontrolled run-offs of hyperpathogenic mutants that get a free ride.
You don't remove the graphite rods and expect to control nuclear fission. You create explosions.