4% is a staggering number and hard to believe. That these people rise to positions of authority is easy to understand. Without the conflict of conscience they have a tremendous advantage. My sisters, and I fought a two year long battle, including the court system against a woman who took control of our elderly father suffering with demen…
4% is a staggering number and hard to believe. That these people rise to positions of authority is easy to understand. Without the conflict of conscience they have a tremendous advantage. My sisters, and I fought a two year long battle, including the court system against a woman who took control of our elderly father suffering with dementia in an effort to steal all of his assets. She almost succeeded.
So true! And I don’t know why, but it appears it’s mostly women who seem to enjoy being the enforcers of overreach.
My DIL informed me a few weeks ago that in her community they are now using drones to fly around the neighborhood and find people who have “violated” the rules and are setting up small chicken coops so as to have access to fresh eggs.
My family had a very similar situation: a man who took control of our father’s elderly cousin suffering with dementia in an effort to steal all of his assets. And he did succeed. My father was his next of kin and visited him about 3x a year as he seemed to mentally deteriorate. He then disappeared. Turned out his stepson had sold his house, moved him, taken power of attorney, bought him a new house but as tenants in common which allowed him to assume ownership on our father’s cousin’s death which happened soon after. Meanwhile my father was having to play detective to track his cousin down- found him 3 weeks after he died. Stepson knew about our father and hid his cousin from him. Stepson was 40 when his mother married our father’s cousin (late marriage, wife died soon after so, adult stepson for 5 years with no obligations because my father was next of kin and visited). Definitely a narcissist.
This sort of thing can happen all too easily. The problem is that it’s rare enough for the normal, sane victim to think “this can’t be happening, it’s so brazen, I must’ve got something wrong”. This plays right into the narcissists strategy of carrying on with being brazen, especially if there’s a big dollop of gaslighting and projection (he complained he had to pay for the tombstone so could he please be reimbursed).
This is a parallel issue with family courts. The rights over a human person can change from theirself or their parents to the state, a professional, or in your case step family, all lacking due process. In terms of guardianship of adults, Sam Sugar has done some incredible interviews, especially on the Maryanne Petri's Slam the Gavel. His organization gives some advice on how to protect you and your family from guardianship.
Similar story happened to an elderly, well-to-do great-aunt years ago. She happened to live (out of state from all her relatives) on her own for many years after her husband passed (no kids). She was isolated on a ranch and was not fond of family visiting. So the family was well behind events as they were happening; the first we learned things were not well was when her deceased brother’s kids (who had moved cross-country for this) answered her door with a weapon to hand, letting inquiring family members know that no, they could not visit their great-aunt as she was sleeping and could not be disturbed. Things went fast after that, culminating in a last hospitalization for her under suspect circumstances, and a even more suspect ending during that hospital visit. By the time her will (everything went to her brother’s kids, despite years of mentions that she wanted to leave it all to her local community) had been read, everything was cemented in stone and the lawyer that my family pooled in for was quick to say that all was legally correct, so sorry. Last I grass, they sold all timber and then the property itself and started a small business on the west coast. Unfortunately, my parents didn’t seem to learn much from this, and so I (only kid) went through a different version of this when they went. You really can’t imagine at the time it’s going on that this terrible thing really is happening and by the time you do, the damages are done.
I’m sorry to hear that story. It seems that this sort of behaviour is fairly prevalent. When it involves money, people show their true colours. I too am going through a different version of this with another family member who ticks all the boxes for narcissistic traits. I didn’t mention it above because it hasn’t played out yet.
I think this thread is useful to other readers, especially younger people who might not have experienced this sort of situation yet. I would say not to be too paranoid but if someone starts to show a pattern that looks as if they’re making a play to steal an inheritance, don’t spend to long in the adjustment phase where you debate whether your misreading the situation or not. Start delving, start asking awkward questions early on (but I know that’s difficult if they’re wielding a gun!). Getting access to the victim and assuring them of your 100% support for them is paramount. I’ve had to do this and have also told the ‘vulture’ that I’ll fight them in the courts with no hesitation if they try again what they had already tried and I stopped.
Good for you! So sorry to hear you are in the midst of all that though. Sometimes it is difficult to realize what’s going on unless you are very close to the vulnerable person. I recall one time I moved to a new area and the next door elderly disabled lady was very kind and we spent time conversing on her better days, since she was right next door. However, after a month or so, one of her favorite caregivers pulled me aside privately and said in no uncertain terms I needed to stay away from her. She was very adamant and unpleasant; completely different from how she normally acted around the elderly lady. I thought about it and decided to do so because I was not a relative and did not need to stir any pots. But it does go to show how things can sometimes easily slip under the radar.
That’s creepy and I’m sorry to hear you had that dilemma of whether to carry on talking to her. I’ve read a fair number of stories in the papers about nefarious carers over the years. Relatives and neighbours need to be ever vigilant especially when there are no close relatives around.
My second comment here (below/above?) was directed to you, Maureen but I’m not sure if it shows as being to you. I don’t understand these vertical thread lines and which replies they refer to.
Agreed. My parents differed from my great aunt by not having a lot of cash, etc. But they did have a house full of antiques. All of which went through the court system with no mention of where they went. Never did get to see a paper record of any accounting. My dad’s car disappeared three days after he passed; nobody knew anything. So sorry you had to go through something like this as well. It is life-changing. 😞
My sisters and I got involved with a group of people whose professions draw them into the orb of sociopathic women praying on wealthy, older men in Southern California. It’s not a small problem.
I think it may have to do with consequences of psycho/sociopathic behaviour.
As recently as the 1970s, such a person had to hide their proclivities (Dahmer's private roadkill-collection in the woods behind their house f.e.) or would be locked up, possibly for life.
Thanks in part to the anti-psychiatry movement but also postmodern and social constructivist schools of thought (you could make the case that secularisation also plays into this), from the 1990s on the ideal is that the person displaying clear psychopathic behaviours as long as they stop short of outright murder/rape (and sometimes not even then!) is to be treated in the community.
Maybe that's why the number has risen from way below 1%?
I disagree about "anti-psychiatry" - we don't state that "it's okay to be psychopath" - anti-psychiatry is about denying the DSM labels and the resulting destructive treatments. Psychiatry is a weapon used to cripple (and make money from) the poor, the struggling, the Other. If people are harming people - you don't need a diagnosis or label for that. It's a crime.
(note: psychiatry ***is*** harming people, and this latest COVIDian assault is just an extension of the arm of psychiatry. Who created the gas ovens in Germany? "We know your needs better than you do." is the mantra of psychiatry - very much like what we've been told about COVID.)
"Anti-psychiatry" has nothing to do with the convenient deinstitutionalisation of inmates - that was a capitalist move. Cheaper to drug them and keep them at home.
More, I blame corporate culture (there was a Canadian film, 2003, called "The Corporation,") wherein corporations are not liable for their individual actions. They are protected from that liability by the Corporation, and to rise in this environment, sociopathy and psychopathy is rewarded. The sociopaths and psychopaths rise to the top of the Corporation. How many corporate crimes have resulted in punishment? Fines are just a cost of doing business.
This rewards the sociopaths and psychopaths - and so they accelerate their crimes.
It was actually being a part of anti-psychiatry which enabled me to see through the bs that the COVIDians were presenting. Same tactics, same gaslighting.
I'm going on anti-psychiatry in my nation, should have pointed that out maybe.
Here, that idea is completely enmeshed with the wokest of the woke.
Thankfully, our psychiatric sector is and has been operating on two basic principles for the last decade now, while still using ICD/DSM-labels for various reasons (many to do with bureaucracy):
1) Is the person a proven danger to others?
2) Is the person a proven danger to themselves?
Those two are, while not formally written down or recognised, the basis for what if any treatment is to be mandated (KBT being the go-to method right now). Otherwise any contact with psychologists, therapists or psychiatrists is voluntary.
I can't see you and @JC disagreed in substance—more like a mismatch in what the anti-psychiatry appellation means to each. Just as you say, the eternal confusion over terms; your implied doesn't equal the other guy's 🙂
Peter Gotzsche is a Dane, he's kinda in this camp. Same with Olga Runciman. We have people who are battling the dangers of psychiatry on all continents. I'm in Australia (though have also experienced the US). But unless you are exposed to the history, then it's something new.
Has "antipsychiatry" been coopted by the Woke? "You can't diagnose me! I was BORN this way!"
More like "How dare you claim to be ableto decidewhat's normal?! Now make with the ADD+ diagnoses and Ritaline and Benzo-prescriptions so I can go on permanent lifelong welfare, all inclusive like!"
I think he’s actually spot on. In the past, before internet, social media that %was probably lower but sociopaths can be created if you have the tools at hand…lots of sick people out there
Let us hope that at some point sanity returns and Trump Derangement Syndrome, Victimization Phantasmagoria, and Reality Inversion are included in the DSM.
4% is a staggering number and hard to believe. That these people rise to positions of authority is easy to understand. Without the conflict of conscience they have a tremendous advantage. My sisters, and I fought a two year long battle, including the court system against a woman who took control of our elderly father suffering with dementia in an effort to steal all of his assets. She almost succeeded.
Look no further than your average Home Owners Association leadership....
Talk about tranny
Ah, but what percentage of their sociopathic behavior is caused by the power over others? As the Stanford prison experiment demonstrated.
So true! And I don’t know why, but it appears it’s mostly women who seem to enjoy being the enforcers of overreach.
My DIL informed me a few weeks ago that in her community they are now using drones to fly around the neighborhood and find people who have “violated” the rules and are setting up small chicken coops so as to have access to fresh eggs.
Oh, the humanity! Despicable egg lovers!
My family had a very similar situation: a man who took control of our father’s elderly cousin suffering with dementia in an effort to steal all of his assets. And he did succeed. My father was his next of kin and visited him about 3x a year as he seemed to mentally deteriorate. He then disappeared. Turned out his stepson had sold his house, moved him, taken power of attorney, bought him a new house but as tenants in common which allowed him to assume ownership on our father’s cousin’s death which happened soon after. Meanwhile my father was having to play detective to track his cousin down- found him 3 weeks after he died. Stepson knew about our father and hid his cousin from him. Stepson was 40 when his mother married our father’s cousin (late marriage, wife died soon after so, adult stepson for 5 years with no obligations because my father was next of kin and visited). Definitely a narcissist.
This sort of thing can happen all too easily. The problem is that it’s rare enough for the normal, sane victim to think “this can’t be happening, it’s so brazen, I must’ve got something wrong”. This plays right into the narcissists strategy of carrying on with being brazen, especially if there’s a big dollop of gaslighting and projection (he complained he had to pay for the tombstone so could he please be reimbursed).
This is a parallel issue with family courts. The rights over a human person can change from theirself or their parents to the state, a professional, or in your case step family, all lacking due process. In terms of guardianship of adults, Sam Sugar has done some incredible interviews, especially on the Maryanne Petri's Slam the Gavel. His organization gives some advice on how to protect you and your family from guardianship.
Similar story happened to an elderly, well-to-do great-aunt years ago. She happened to live (out of state from all her relatives) on her own for many years after her husband passed (no kids). She was isolated on a ranch and was not fond of family visiting. So the family was well behind events as they were happening; the first we learned things were not well was when her deceased brother’s kids (who had moved cross-country for this) answered her door with a weapon to hand, letting inquiring family members know that no, they could not visit their great-aunt as she was sleeping and could not be disturbed. Things went fast after that, culminating in a last hospitalization for her under suspect circumstances, and a even more suspect ending during that hospital visit. By the time her will (everything went to her brother’s kids, despite years of mentions that she wanted to leave it all to her local community) had been read, everything was cemented in stone and the lawyer that my family pooled in for was quick to say that all was legally correct, so sorry. Last I grass, they sold all timber and then the property itself and started a small business on the west coast. Unfortunately, my parents didn’t seem to learn much from this, and so I (only kid) went through a different version of this when they went. You really can’t imagine at the time it’s going on that this terrible thing really is happening and by the time you do, the damages are done.
I’m sorry to hear that story. It seems that this sort of behaviour is fairly prevalent. When it involves money, people show their true colours. I too am going through a different version of this with another family member who ticks all the boxes for narcissistic traits. I didn’t mention it above because it hasn’t played out yet.
I think this thread is useful to other readers, especially younger people who might not have experienced this sort of situation yet. I would say not to be too paranoid but if someone starts to show a pattern that looks as if they’re making a play to steal an inheritance, don’t spend to long in the adjustment phase where you debate whether your misreading the situation or not. Start delving, start asking awkward questions early on (but I know that’s difficult if they’re wielding a gun!). Getting access to the victim and assuring them of your 100% support for them is paramount. I’ve had to do this and have also told the ‘vulture’ that I’ll fight them in the courts with no hesitation if they try again what they had already tried and I stopped.
Good for you! So sorry to hear you are in the midst of all that though. Sometimes it is difficult to realize what’s going on unless you are very close to the vulnerable person. I recall one time I moved to a new area and the next door elderly disabled lady was very kind and we spent time conversing on her better days, since she was right next door. However, after a month or so, one of her favorite caregivers pulled me aside privately and said in no uncertain terms I needed to stay away from her. She was very adamant and unpleasant; completely different from how she normally acted around the elderly lady. I thought about it and decided to do so because I was not a relative and did not need to stir any pots. But it does go to show how things can sometimes easily slip under the radar.
That’s creepy and I’m sorry to hear you had that dilemma of whether to carry on talking to her. I’ve read a fair number of stories in the papers about nefarious carers over the years. Relatives and neighbours need to be ever vigilant especially when there are no close relatives around.
My second comment here (below/above?) was directed to you, Maureen but I’m not sure if it shows as being to you. I don’t understand these vertical thread lines and which replies they refer to.
Agreed. My parents differed from my great aunt by not having a lot of cash, etc. But they did have a house full of antiques. All of which went through the court system with no mention of where they went. Never did get to see a paper record of any accounting. My dad’s car disappeared three days after he passed; nobody knew anything. So sorry you had to go through something like this as well. It is life-changing. 😞
Thank you for your input which helps to build up a picture of the different ways this phenomenon manifests itself.
My sisters and I got involved with a group of people whose professions draw them into the orb of sociopathic women praying on wealthy, older men in Southern California. It’s not a small problem.
Thanks, it’s interesting to see these stories to build up some sort of overall picture even though they’re depressing to see!
I think it may have to do with consequences of psycho/sociopathic behaviour.
As recently as the 1970s, such a person had to hide their proclivities (Dahmer's private roadkill-collection in the woods behind their house f.e.) or would be locked up, possibly for life.
Thanks in part to the anti-psychiatry movement but also postmodern and social constructivist schools of thought (you could make the case that secularisation also plays into this), from the 1990s on the ideal is that the person displaying clear psychopathic behaviours as long as they stop short of outright murder/rape (and sometimes not even then!) is to be treated in the community.
Maybe that's why the number has risen from way below 1%?
I disagree about "anti-psychiatry" - we don't state that "it's okay to be psychopath" - anti-psychiatry is about denying the DSM labels and the resulting destructive treatments. Psychiatry is a weapon used to cripple (and make money from) the poor, the struggling, the Other. If people are harming people - you don't need a diagnosis or label for that. It's a crime.
(note: psychiatry ***is*** harming people, and this latest COVIDian assault is just an extension of the arm of psychiatry. Who created the gas ovens in Germany? "We know your needs better than you do." is the mantra of psychiatry - very much like what we've been told about COVID.)
"Anti-psychiatry" has nothing to do with the convenient deinstitutionalisation of inmates - that was a capitalist move. Cheaper to drug them and keep them at home.
More, I blame corporate culture (there was a Canadian film, 2003, called "The Corporation,") wherein corporations are not liable for their individual actions. They are protected from that liability by the Corporation, and to rise in this environment, sociopathy and psychopathy is rewarded. The sociopaths and psychopaths rise to the top of the Corporation. How many corporate crimes have resulted in punishment? Fines are just a cost of doing business.
This rewards the sociopaths and psychopaths - and so they accelerate their crimes.
It was actually being a part of anti-psychiatry which enabled me to see through the bs that the COVIDians were presenting. Same tactics, same gaslighting.
I'm going on anti-psychiatry in my nation, should have pointed that out maybe.
Here, that idea is completely enmeshed with the wokest of the woke.
Thankfully, our psychiatric sector is and has been operating on two basic principles for the last decade now, while still using ICD/DSM-labels for various reasons (many to do with bureaucracy):
1) Is the person a proven danger to others?
2) Is the person a proven danger to themselves?
Those two are, while not formally written down or recognised, the basis for what if any treatment is to be mandated (KBT being the go-to method right now). Otherwise any contact with psychologists, therapists or psychiatrists is voluntary.
I'm not american, so hence the confusion caused.
I can't see you and @JC disagreed in substance—more like a mismatch in what the anti-psychiatry appellation means to each. Just as you say, the eternal confusion over terms; your implied doesn't equal the other guy's 🙂
Peter Gotzsche is a Dane, he's kinda in this camp. Same with Olga Runciman. We have people who are battling the dangers of psychiatry on all continents. I'm in Australia (though have also experienced the US). But unless you are exposed to the history, then it's something new.
Has "antipsychiatry" been coopted by the Woke? "You can't diagnose me! I was BORN this way!"
More like "How dare you claim to be ableto decidewhat's normal?! Now make with the ADD+ diagnoses and Ritaline and Benzo-prescriptions so I can go on permanent lifelong welfare, all inclusive like!"
I.e. entitlement-itis galore.
Outstanding point and question
Whatever the number, it is increasing. Drugs cannot be good for sanity.
Bingo
Too low. I've personally run into far to many over my decades of rebellion and resistance. FAR too many...
I think he’s actually spot on. In the past, before internet, social media that %was probably lower but sociopaths can be created if you have the tools at hand…lots of sick people out there
Honestly, I think some of the drugs they give people for these so called psychiatric problems turn them into sociopaths.
Adderall being a prime example imo.
Let us hope that at some point sanity returns and Trump Derangement Syndrome, Victimization Phantasmagoria, and Reality Inversion are included in the DSM.
Sign me up for a bad case of Malignant Creativity!
I think we are charter members, amigo.
https://pathwhisperer.info/2011/09/20/post-redux-are-saps-socially-adept-psychopaths-real/
https://pathwhisperer.info/2020/10/10/pw-goes-all-in-psychopathy-as-a-green-beard-trait/
Ps are at least 1 in 20. Hidden as SAPs, socially acceptable pyschopaths. Interbreeding subspecies.
I thought it was 2% but maybe we’re producing more c