when a faded news rag that has earned the sobriquet of “pravda by the hudson” more times over than i have had hot breakfasts literally comes out in opposition to “critical thinking” because “it does not help in the fight against misinformation” i’m sorry guys, but i have to call it:
can anyone doubt that we’re about 15 minutes from these self styled wanna-be elites jumping up and down in the sort of torrential tantrum that would mortify a 4 year old and screaming “why won’t you proles just do as you’re told!!!”
gonna be fun to watch.
past a certain level of blatancy, this is the kind of credibility you never get back.
“the official line shall not be subjected to the critical faculties of the people” constitutes such an obvious and slippery, self-serving lie as to disqualify the speaker from serious discourse.
not many things do, but this sort of appeal to baseless credentialism and status at the expense of reason and scientific method is one of them.
me, i love a good rabbit hole. that’s where all the fun stuff is…
so let’s not accede to this irresponsible impingement into our intellects, but rather keep our wits and wiles about us and make our own way to truth.
the liturgy in latin so the congregants may not understand or question it represents a hopelessly anachronistic and high handed practice.
these are the tools of elitist domination, not the values of the enlightenment.
and with all these rabbit holes around, there’s gotta be a bunny in here somewhere…
Sounds a bit like that MIT review of social media posts by Covid Skeptics, where they found that there was a bit of rigor but were puzzled that the Skeptics viewed Science as a Process rather than an Institution.
We have to apply Theory of Mind analysis as to what's going on with them. 1) They are convinced this is a once in century plague. 2) Their confirmation bias has proved to themselves that rain dancing NPI works. 3) The unknowns such as variants are truly frightening, and the precautionary principle requires taking drastic action. 4) Then along come these "critical thinkers", who are welcome during normal times, but who now could torpedo all the hard-won gains and send us off the edge of a cliff. We simply do not have the space or time to indulge in academic "critical thought". 4) We must now do everything to suppress the alternative narrative, to save humankind, even if it means suspending critical thinking temporarily.
Well said. The big question is - Why. Why the irrational fear? There's something (or a lot of things) in the psyche of the collectivist that individualists don't understand. They're wired differently than we are. I think we're learning that the political spectrum is really collectivists (left) vs individualists (right), not liberal vs conservative. The theory is collectivist-individualist is a "wiring" thing, perhaps from birth. Liberal-conservative is more a choice. Heck, look at Gato. He might be the top candidate for conservative of the year.
What do you suggest to those who do NOT want the vaccine, but the heads of these agencies , slurping up all this mis-information, are now mandating it for them to come to work. My kid just got this news today. She's healthy and in her early 30s. She's in tears and angry. It's a behavioral health facility for children. Haven't had any issues with kids or adults. Medical and Religious waivers offered with 2x week testing. Antibody tests not accepted. I told her to quit and find something else, but I think all places like this are going to be following suit. Suggestions? Thanks!
I think I might go with the nocebo defence. Still to do the research. Mentally, I have a psychiatric phobia against all medication, I believe all medical intervention is harmful (nocebo effect). Like the placebo effect, the mind over body can have a major impact. So in my case, I know the vaccine is going to kill me (ok, that may be irrational, but I can't convince my mind of that). So, I'm going to try and get a psychiatrist to give me a Nocebo Certificate of Exemption on the basis that the vaccine will do me more harm than good.
If more people walk away from this nonsense, it will have to stop. Or at least be limited. It’s interesting that Walmart chooses to mandate vax to management but not frontline. A revolt amongst the proles who do their bidding would not work well for stockholders, I suppose.
She's certainly not alone. I suggest doing some serious research on the vaccine. It's not really as scary or foreign to the normal working of the immune system as one might conjure up. Yesterday I conceded to the J&J because my manic collectivist elite older brother would not stop harassing me, and his rhetoric was getting increasingly aggressive. I saw it eventually becoming a choice between the vaccine and a relationship with he and his family. He's normally a really smart and thoughtful guy, but covid somehow became his kryptonite. She should hold out as long as she can, but may have to concede to the manic majority on this one. There will be more worthy hills for freedom loving individualists to die on. I hope that doesn't prove to be terribly naive.
I am concerned (and she is more than I) that it will negatively impact her cycle and possibly chances of having children. There are so many things about this experimental shot we do not know.
That fear might be unfounded, especially for the J&J. The good thing about not fearing the virus and holding out on the vaccine is it allows more time to see if those concerns are valid. It's telling that Alex Berenson has gotten away from the side effect angle and has changed focus to the decreasing efficacy. Good news for those fearing the vaccine. Bad for those fearing the virus.
I've become so accustomed to rabbit holes that I sometimes feel like that guy in the Airstream in the middle of the Arizona desert with tin foil on the windows. Did you ever notice, though, that he's always the only guy in the movie who actually knows what going on?
Exactly! I’ve been so outside the mainstream this last year, from family and friends, I don’t know how I’d have made it without the folks like El Gato, Gummi Beat, Ethical Skeptic, Phil Kerpin, et al.
I can’t tell if your comment about “the liturgy in Latin” is entirely serious. Latin was once the language of the people (“vulgar” like the Latin Vulgate Bible). Catholics believe the Mass is when eternity enters into time; it wouldn’t be entirely anachronistic to maintain a language — but more to the point, a rite (if you are alluding to the recent misguided restrictions on, not Latin per se but on the “old” or “extraordinary” or Tridentine form of the Mass) — wherein, human time is let’s say sacramentally superseded. What’s more is that the use of Latin has historically allowed greater clarification of and “critical thinking” about even the deepest mysteries. If I’ve misunderstood, fine, I look like a bunny rabbit about now. But the bad cats of the Catholic Church like their Agnus Dei.
Yes, pretty sure that is the backwards interpretation of things. Of course, the people understand the raw material well enough, the data in the case of COVID, and the the Latin, in the case of the Mass.
It is the powerful people, some Bishops or health authorities, who think it is dangerous to let the common person have access to the source material, both in the case of the Mass and in reviewing COVID literature, not so much because it is dangerous, rather the fact that their special knowledge will be exposed once people do their own research.
Good points. The expert’s deployment of ambiguity whether in liturgical “reform” or in public health pronouncements and prevarications is also a tool that appeals to aspirational elitists everywhere. I think the NYT practically invented that audience.
it's a reference to the protestant reformation and the attendant enlightenment.
the catholics sought to keep the bible and the mass in latin and thus inaccessible to most congregants. authority was vested in the clerisy, not the laypeople.
translating the bible and moving the mass to the spoken tongues of the populace made the words accessible to the masses and moved the idea of interpretation into the personal instead of relying upon "experts."
it was a profoundly fundamental shift in view and was a part of what set off the enlightenment especially as so many protestant sects advocated learning to read so that people could read bibles.
this spread of literacy had profound societal impact.
Thanks for the reasoned response, but I think it is a common misconception.
The Latin used at Mass was well understood by a huge number of people. The Homily or Sermon was in the local language in the Middle Ages.
As people became more literate, and books started being distributed, everyday people began discussing thing like interpretations, and theology, and realized that the Bishop may not have all the answers, rather he might be a hereditary flunky who makes bold proclamations without theological backing.
It is the very access to Latin (or Hebrew and Greek) that gave the everyday person the backing data to question the powers that be, not so much the haphazard translation of the theological texts into the vernacular.
Thomas Aquinas had some well thought out theological and practical teachings (he wrote extensively on weights and measures, for example). When Joe (or Giuseppe) Peasant read through Aquinas, he probably had some second thoughts on what the Duke or Lord had to say about things.
They still taught in Latin at the Archdiocese of Chicago Seminary (Mundelein) until the 50's or 60's.
I get it, thanks for the thoughtful response and for all your work. You didn’t mention the Bible specifically or the Protestant Reformation just the liturgy in the post. I jumped as it’s a very current topic still (whereas Biblical translations from not only the Latin but also using the original Hebrew and Greek are acceptable now even in the Catholic Church). The gatekeepers of the secret knowledge hardly know that the cat is out of the bag.
It would be fitting, no perfect if the rag that carries the water for the liberal elites has just called the top in the COVID propaganda sweepstakes. Just listen to us and by extension Uncle Joe and Andy because we have it all under control if only you silly wabbits would stop going down that rabbit hole. I mean 16 months in, with the mask mandates back and fall lockdowns around the corner, why would you dare to peak in the rabbit hole? Just double mask up, sit back and we will let you know when you can go for your first of many boosters!
i was sent to a training class early in my military career, there were students from other country's military who used our systems.
one of the common questions often to the american in the next seat was "how come.....?' they needed context, and they needed to think the subject matter through
years later i was the teacher, and we used critical thinking to get the knowledge across, we "used" why's but 'how comes' could'a worked.
if you do not take the subject in to the "rabbit hole" you are hiding things from the thirster of knowledge...
Sounds a bit like that MIT review of social media posts by Covid Skeptics, where they found that there was a bit of rigor but were puzzled that the Skeptics viewed Science as a Process rather than an Institution.
being called out by name in that hilarity of a hit piece is one of my favorite badges of honor.
"how dare these people root ideas of "science" in the exploration of data and replication of results! they should trust the experts!"
said no real scientist.
ever.
https://boriquagato.substack.com/p/science-is-a-process-not-an-institution
o tempores o mores......
Yup...crazy.
"It's difficult because the anti-mask & anti-lockdown people seem to be the ones who have the most information."
Still think that was a Titania McGrath parody, but no, unfortunately it was true.
We have to apply Theory of Mind analysis as to what's going on with them. 1) They are convinced this is a once in century plague. 2) Their confirmation bias has proved to themselves that rain dancing NPI works. 3) The unknowns such as variants are truly frightening, and the precautionary principle requires taking drastic action. 4) Then along come these "critical thinkers", who are welcome during normal times, but who now could torpedo all the hard-won gains and send us off the edge of a cliff. We simply do not have the space or time to indulge in academic "critical thought". 4) We must now do everything to suppress the alternative narrative, to save humankind, even if it means suspending critical thinking temporarily.
Well said. The big question is - Why. Why the irrational fear? There's something (or a lot of things) in the psyche of the collectivist that individualists don't understand. They're wired differently than we are. I think we're learning that the political spectrum is really collectivists (left) vs individualists (right), not liberal vs conservative. The theory is collectivist-individualist is a "wiring" thing, perhaps from birth. Liberal-conservative is more a choice. Heck, look at Gato. He might be the top candidate for conservative of the year.
What do you suggest to those who do NOT want the vaccine, but the heads of these agencies , slurping up all this mis-information, are now mandating it for them to come to work. My kid just got this news today. She's healthy and in her early 30s. She's in tears and angry. It's a behavioral health facility for children. Haven't had any issues with kids or adults. Medical and Religious waivers offered with 2x week testing. Antibody tests not accepted. I told her to quit and find something else, but I think all places like this are going to be following suit. Suggestions? Thanks!
never [again] vote for a democrat.....
I’ve had allergenic reactions to vaccines in the past. Wait and see is a non-contentious response.
And lucky for you because you did you can now claim medical exemption from this one if your work place required it!
I think I might go with the nocebo defence. Still to do the research. Mentally, I have a psychiatric phobia against all medication, I believe all medical intervention is harmful (nocebo effect). Like the placebo effect, the mind over body can have a major impact. So in my case, I know the vaccine is going to kill me (ok, that may be irrational, but I can't convince my mind of that). So, I'm going to try and get a psychiatrist to give me a Nocebo Certificate of Exemption on the basis that the vaccine will do me more harm than good.
1. i submitted to the vaxx, i am over 70 and in general good health. my risk reward said: NO!
2. but my living arrangement is such 'karen' would be more dangerous than the vaxx side effects
3. i am old enough the long term neuro risks are not an issue.
4. i do do flu each year bc #2 i am used to it.
i am prone not to submit to covidiots
Look up Peggy Hall and her website. She had some good options to try with resources. Good luck to your daughter
Thank you! She is so angry and upset-one of their most tireless workers with the biggest heart for these throw-away kids. Thank you!
If more people walk away from this nonsense, it will have to stop. Or at least be limited. It’s interesting that Walmart chooses to mandate vax to management but not frontline. A revolt amongst the proles who do their bidding would not work well for stockholders, I suppose.
I thought we lived in a free country and were able to make our own choices. Especially about things like this.
She's certainly not alone. I suggest doing some serious research on the vaccine. It's not really as scary or foreign to the normal working of the immune system as one might conjure up. Yesterday I conceded to the J&J because my manic collectivist elite older brother would not stop harassing me, and his rhetoric was getting increasingly aggressive. I saw it eventually becoming a choice between the vaccine and a relationship with he and his family. He's normally a really smart and thoughtful guy, but covid somehow became his kryptonite. She should hold out as long as she can, but may have to concede to the manic majority on this one. There will be more worthy hills for freedom loving individualists to die on. I hope that doesn't prove to be terribly naive.
I am concerned (and she is more than I) that it will negatively impact her cycle and possibly chances of having children. There are so many things about this experimental shot we do not know.
That fear might be unfounded, especially for the J&J. The good thing about not fearing the virus and holding out on the vaccine is it allows more time to see if those concerns are valid. It's telling that Alex Berenson has gotten away from the side effect angle and has changed focus to the decreasing efficacy. Good news for those fearing the vaccine. Bad for those fearing the virus.
Thanks! And great points!
I hadn't seen that article. Wow. Just wow.
I've become so accustomed to rabbit holes that I sometimes feel like that guy in the Airstream in the middle of the Arizona desert with tin foil on the windows. Did you ever notice, though, that he's always the only guy in the movie who actually knows what going on?
Exactly! I’ve been so outside the mainstream this last year, from family and friends, I don’t know how I’d have made it without the folks like El Gato, Gummi Beat, Ethical Skeptic, Phil Kerpin, et al.
I can’t tell if your comment about “the liturgy in Latin” is entirely serious. Latin was once the language of the people (“vulgar” like the Latin Vulgate Bible). Catholics believe the Mass is when eternity enters into time; it wouldn’t be entirely anachronistic to maintain a language — but more to the point, a rite (if you are alluding to the recent misguided restrictions on, not Latin per se but on the “old” or “extraordinary” or Tridentine form of the Mass) — wherein, human time is let’s say sacramentally superseded. What’s more is that the use of Latin has historically allowed greater clarification of and “critical thinking” about even the deepest mysteries. If I’ve misunderstood, fine, I look like a bunny rabbit about now. But the bad cats of the Catholic Church like their Agnus Dei.
Yes, pretty sure that is the backwards interpretation of things. Of course, the people understand the raw material well enough, the data in the case of COVID, and the the Latin, in the case of the Mass.
It is the powerful people, some Bishops or health authorities, who think it is dangerous to let the common person have access to the source material, both in the case of the Mass and in reviewing COVID literature, not so much because it is dangerous, rather the fact that their special knowledge will be exposed once people do their own research.
Good points. The expert’s deployment of ambiguity whether in liturgical “reform” or in public health pronouncements and prevarications is also a tool that appeals to aspirational elitists everywhere. I think the NYT practically invented that audience.
it's a reference to the protestant reformation and the attendant enlightenment.
the catholics sought to keep the bible and the mass in latin and thus inaccessible to most congregants. authority was vested in the clerisy, not the laypeople.
translating the bible and moving the mass to the spoken tongues of the populace made the words accessible to the masses and moved the idea of interpretation into the personal instead of relying upon "experts."
it was a profoundly fundamental shift in view and was a part of what set off the enlightenment especially as so many protestant sects advocated learning to read so that people could read bibles.
this spread of literacy had profound societal impact.
Thanks for the reasoned response, but I think it is a common misconception.
The Latin used at Mass was well understood by a huge number of people. The Homily or Sermon was in the local language in the Middle Ages.
As people became more literate, and books started being distributed, everyday people began discussing thing like interpretations, and theology, and realized that the Bishop may not have all the answers, rather he might be a hereditary flunky who makes bold proclamations without theological backing.
It is the very access to Latin (or Hebrew and Greek) that gave the everyday person the backing data to question the powers that be, not so much the haphazard translation of the theological texts into the vernacular.
Thomas Aquinas had some well thought out theological and practical teachings (he wrote extensively on weights and measures, for example). When Joe (or Giuseppe) Peasant read through Aquinas, he probably had some second thoughts on what the Duke or Lord had to say about things.
They still taught in Latin at the Archdiocese of Chicago Seminary (Mundelein) until the 50's or 60's.
I get it, thanks for the thoughtful response and for all your work. You didn’t mention the Bible specifically or the Protestant Reformation just the liturgy in the post. I jumped as it’s a very current topic still (whereas Biblical translations from not only the Latin but also using the original Hebrew and Greek are acceptable now even in the Catholic Church). The gatekeepers of the secret knowledge hardly know that the cat is out of the bag.
There’s a big fight in the church right now about the Latin mass. Or so I’ve heard from Dr. E. Michael Jones.
It would be fitting, no perfect if the rag that carries the water for the liberal elites has just called the top in the COVID propaganda sweepstakes. Just listen to us and by extension Uncle Joe and Andy because we have it all under control if only you silly wabbits would stop going down that rabbit hole. I mean 16 months in, with the mask mandates back and fall lockdowns around the corner, why would you dare to peak in the rabbit hole? Just double mask up, sit back and we will let you know when you can go for your first of many boosters!
I love your use of language. Your sobriquet is gato elegante.
i was sent to a training class early in my military career, there were students from other country's military who used our systems.
one of the common questions often to the american in the next seat was "how come.....?' they needed context, and they needed to think the subject matter through
years later i was the teacher, and we used critical thinking to get the knowledge across, we "used" why's but 'how comes' could'a worked.
if you do not take the subject in to the "rabbit hole" you are hiding things from the thirster of knowledge...
My favorite couple 😻. They do actually get along quite well. 🐱 🐰